Assembly and Research System

How do you feel about this suggestion?

  • I dislike the thought of needing so many resources to go through the stages. Otherwise, great!

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Other (Thoughts Posted in Comments)

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    12
  • Poll closed .

Space Viking

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Jun 30, 2013
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Oh yeah, I forgot lower tier hardware wouldn't necessarily be rendered obsolete as soon the next tier had been unlocked. A tier 1 lander could be reused in the Jovian system, since the moons there are actually lower gravity worlds (except from Io) compared to the Moon. In fact, that's pretty much the case of the entire outer solar system. Titan would be the only unique exception because of its atmosphere.

When traveling within a local systems like that, all one could possibly need is just a tier 1 rocket+lander combo.

I'd imagine tiers would function like this:

- Tier 1
Booster: The cheapest kind of rocket are made of these. Insufficient for full-fledged expeditions through interplanetary space.

Capsule: A basic crew pod. For balance reasons I think it should together with a single tier 1 rocket always be capable of taking the player back home. Supposedly its life-support and propulsion just enough for a 1-way trip through interplanetary space (hence why it's not used for interplanetary expeditions).

Lander: Can only be used for worlds with no (or minimal) atmosphere. Despite being low tiered it's still very adaptable.


-Tier 2
Booster: Offers twice the lifting power. Perhaps its distinct feature would be an aerospike engine?

Capsule: Fully capable of interplanetary travels due to more advanced life-support and propulsion system.

Lander: A more elaborate lander designed for worlds with a notable atmosphere. Its engine could also be an aerospike. It will float in liquid.


-Tier 3
Who knows!


I've also been thinking of the GUI, and it's overlapping Not Enough Items GUI elements. But I supposed there's actually no real issues with that, since for example, Tinkers' Construct simply hides NEI's GUI while having the smeltery open. Galacticraft could do the same, potentially.

Anyhow, I've been refining the rocket assembly GUI concept, which is now known as Vehicle Assembly:





Earlier I suggested the simplicity of a regular tier 1 booster magically splitting into two side boosters if used in the 3rd rocket slot. But for sake of conceptual demonstration of alternatives, I've this time made an actual booster slot to show how it could look like. What they should be fueled on ingame is up to discussion.

This concept is also exploring the possibility of a Docking/Spacestation Module. It should be a more comprehensive alternative over the regular "taking an x amount of resources into space". Once deployed it should roughly look something like this:





That's right, the player is free to build his spacestation from here. I'm also suggesting docking ports could allow inter-vehicular transfers for a direct boarding of your spacestation. An EVA transfer could still be done if necessary (and possibly have your CSM strapped to the spacestation to prevent it from floating away). I'm not entirely sure about the docking process however. It's also heading to the realm of off-topic, so I'll stop for now.
 

Ops. The Xeno

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May 3, 2014
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I love the idea of more complexity to rockets and their components, and I also like space Vikings cool GUI and ideas. Hope this is added to the mod.
 

Douglas_Fresh

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Sep 17, 2013
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Oh yeah, I forgot lower tier hardware wouldn't necessarily be rendered obsolete as soon the next tier had been unlocked. A tier 1 lander could be reused in the Jovian system, since the moons there are actually lower gravity worlds (except from Io) compared to the Moon. In fact, that's pretty much the case of the entire outer solar system. Titan would be the only unique exception because of its atmosphere...
By the beard of Zeus!!! It's so beautiful!!
MoonAvatar-5 So Glorious.png
 

MoltonMontro

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Nov 4, 2013
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cool but i really doubt it would happen.... I dont support anyways. This sounds very similar to space exploreration suggestion that has turned down and i already said.
I dont want to unlock EVERYTHING.
It does? How did you get that? What I got from it was; click Create Space Station, Lander move in, Docking Module Deploys.
 

Ezer'Arch

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May 18, 2013
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Space Viking, please, go to hell with all you awesome and shining GUI designs. They're burning my eyes! :3

If you guys think GUI posts deserve their own topic, I can split the topic if need be.

Quoted wrong post with wrong post.
sigh...
Also, please pay attention to what the other posts just above yours have already stated (...) don't post just for heck of it.
A bit rephrased but still applies.
 

MoltonMontro

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Nov 4, 2013
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Space Viking, please, go to hell with all you awesome and shining GUI designs. They're burning my eyes! :3

If you guys think GUI posts deserve their own topic, I can split the topic if need be.


sigh...

A bit rephrased but still applies.
Split it! :D Just keep the research part of it here also
 

Space Viking

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Jun 30, 2013
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:)

What are the blue things at the top in your Research GUI? Blueprints?
I was thinking of something like that. Though I pretty much tossed together whatever idea I could come up with, even if it wasn't necessary a good one.

Also, does that mean the same table has to be used to? Or as long as you researched it, then it doesn't matter what table you use, but the table stores the information also?
I'm not entirely sure myself of all the mechanics. Though I've been thinking of perhaps condensing the Research Table, the Blueprint Bench and Development Station into an R&D Station. Possibly could data be printed from R&D stations as blueprints. I haven't thought it all out yet however.

If you guys think GUI posts deserve their own topic, I can split the topic if need be.
I actually think it may stay here as the Vehicle Assembly GUI contains modules that might face some more discussion relevant to this topic. Also, I think by focusing more on discussing research and development first would help shape a more solid idea on potential ingame technologies for the logical next step, namely vehicle assembly and mission launch.


So onto the topic:

I've been thinking of trying making research and development system in GC as active experience as possible. The system should be relatively simple and research points might instead be balanced to achievements/milestones rather than having passively generated over time.

Oh BTW, did someone say GUI?



(Note: the node "Extra Boosters" and "Orbital Docking" is poorly located because I'm lazy, so bite me)


Here's another concept on an initial technology tree. I thought "Basic Space Tech" could make sense for the first node, since it's a tier 1 rocket and unmanned space probing. Namely is your first challenge to get an satellite into orbit, which could offer the practical aspect of enabling an mini-map. The third icon is a lander probe, which just happened to be there. I was thinking of something about sending a lunar landing probe as the next challenge, but that's not really in accordance with the GUI concept.

Anyhow, the next node in this GUI concept is "Manned Spaceflight" (manned capsule and EVA suit) succeeded by the two alternate paths "Extra Boosters" (SRBs and direct-ascent landing booster) and "Orbital Docking" (lunar module). Both would represent alternate ways of landing on the Moon. Researching both of the nodes are necessary later for establishing space stations ( since it logically needs both heavy-lifting and docking).

The tab "Milestones" could be a parallel tree that provides the player with clear goals on what needs to be achieved to progress. Potentially it's ditching blueprints all together. Though such a system works best as an individual thing where a player universally "remembers" all the technologies indefinitely. It's a concept that perhaps could conflict with multiplayer games where the space programs often are common ordeals.

This requires some further considerations.
 

MoltonMontro

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Nov 4, 2013
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So, it would also replace the NASA Workbench, or would that be the Vehicle Assembly? Or is Vehicle Assembly part of this R&D Machine?

Also, where;s the prerequisites and extra requirements located? Shouldn't you have to travel to some planets to learn about the celestial body and learn new stuff?
 

MoltonMontro

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Nov 4, 2013
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I'd like to point out some flaws in these GUIs.

Storage is included where? In the design of payloads?

Where's the GUI for crafting the new stuff? Is it the NASA Workbench? Or is it the first blueprint GUI you showed us?

Would some rockets take up larger rocket pads than others?

Do we have our shock absorber, harpoons, space station module, recon drone, or automated satellites in the lander design, or payload, or what?
 

Ezer'Arch

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I actually think it may stay here as the Vehicle Assembly GUI contains modules that might face some more discussion relevant to this topic. Also, I think by focusing more on discussing research and development first would help shape a more solid idea on potential ingame technologies for the logical next step, namely vehicle assembly and mission launch.
I renamed the topic to "Assembly and Research System". I think it suffices. :)
 

Space Viking

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Jun 30, 2013
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:D

So, it would also replace the NASA Workbench, or would that be the Vehicle Assembly? Or is Vehicle Assembly part of this R&D Machine?
I've imagine these as separate machines. Logical order would be this: R&D Station -> NASA Workbench -> Vehicle Assembly

R&D could either by a single device or a multi-setup like you originally suggested. NASA Workbench would be for constructing rocket parts, which alone are about as big as the current GC rockets. Because of the size of the parts, you need some kind of gantry for assembling the rocket parts, which namely is the Vehicle Assembly. It would also serve as launch platform.

Also, where;s the prerequisites and extra requirements located? Shouldn't you have to travel to some planets to learn about the celestial body and learn new stuff?
These details aren't included yet, but I'd imagine them as simple numerals being displayed in the nodes. Traveling to new celestial bodies should nevertheless be a critical part, since it would range from simply landing on the Moon to raiding a Moon dungeon as the final step for unlocking the next tier: a manned expedition to Mars.

Are milestones the same thing as achievements, or like a longer version with more basic stuff?
I'm thinking of them as pretty much the same, but it doesn't strictly need to be that either.

Storage is included where? In the design of payloads?
Are you thinking of the Vehicle Assembly GUI? Storage could manually be transferred directly into the command module. Otherwise there's already a cargo loader in regular GC.

Where's the GUI for crafting the new stuff? Is it the NASA Workbench? Or is it the first blueprint GUI you showed us?
It's the NASA Workbench that builds unlockable space technology. Aside from rockets, it can also be lunar rovers and EVA suits. I haven't thought all the details about it though.

Would some rockets take up larger rocket pads than others?
Right now I'm thinking of one universal size. In general is big entities problematic in MC and I don't know how far it should be pushed.

Do we have our shock absorber, harpoons, space station module, recon drone, or automated satellites in the lander design, or payload, or what?
I've been thinking of categorizing payload into a system of Primary, Secondary, Tertiary, etc. Primary would be a command module or an unmanned control unit. Any additional payload is contextually deployed. I.E. it can't be deployed by simply having it in your inventory space. For example:

- You can't go to the moon unless a lunar lander is in your secondary payload.

- A moon rocket can rendezvous with a space station in low orbit before going to the Moon. The spacecraft will still have its lander packed behind fairings and the booster stage used for TLI.

- Docking/Space Station Modules can either be deployed right away or you can be deployed when the selected destination has been reached.

- If a rocket's payload is a CSM+Lander+Docking Module combo on a trip to Mars, the Docking Module could be deployed first upon arrival (alias creating a space station in Martian orbit). The lander would be docked on the opposite side of the Docking Module and ready for use. The CSM would respectively be used for getting you back home.

Specific upgrades would presumably already be installed inside your lander/spacecraft and ready for contextual use.

Perhaps just like later Apollo missions, the CSM could come upgraded/packed with a satellite? In a similar way the Lander could be installed with a lander probe used for surface reconnaissance. Or maybe all of that would be on the Docking Module?